What type of armour is wearing?
Hello guys.

This is some kind of statue in Kiev. I guess its armour is someking of medieval Russian or Greek one, but i have no idea.
Do you know if this type of armour really existed, when, hw they were employed and how they were made?


Thank you.

P.D.
I have seen similar armours in greek icons too.
Just if anyone knows, Do you know if there is any Saint Michael Archangel´s paint or WOODCUT :D , with a maximilian armour from XVI century?[/img]


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Michael_archangel_Kiev_SHCH.jpg

Looks sort of like that leather armour I've seen on some Roman figures.

M.
Initial guess is that it is from Rennisance Italy. There was a big movement to do Roman-ized armour. Very rennisance-ish, but with an eye to Roman feel, and imagery.
Thanks guys, and, What do you think about this Icon?
I don´t know its age.


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Saint Michael 4.jpg

Not totally sure of the origin (aka. if it is the original culture, or another one portraying art in the original style).

Definately Byzantine. The lamellar across the body, along with the hanging skirt are the first indication. What really set this as truly Byzantine is the lamellar sleeve (almost all effigies have 3 lames of lamellar on the upper arm), along with teh bazubands on the forearm.

My initial guess is a Byzantine wall effigy of St. Michael.
I heard that lamellar armours were made of steel too for heavy cavalry, Do you know if they used some kind of gloves and mail or other protection for their arms and legs?

Thanks

Anybody knows of any Saint Michael painting with Maximilian armour? (All i found is wearing Milanese armour)
M. Eversberg II wrote:
Looks sort of like that leather armour I've seen on some Roman figures.

M.

There is no evidence for leather armour on any Roman figures.
Rodolfo Martínez wrote:
I heard that lamellar armours were made of steel too for heavy cavalry

Armour in general was often heavier foir cavalry than infantry. Specifically there are plenty of examples of cavalry wearing lamellar from Byzantium through to Japan.
Looks like a late baroque work, heavily restored or even remade, as many eastern european towns were badly damaged in WW2, not to mention the deliberate curch destructions following the soviet upheaval.

You will notice that the wall plaster is perfect, no sign of repainting over oldest strata as it is typical of intact buildings.

In any case the cuirass and faulds are the result of the usual western europen re-interpretation of roman armor, shield appears as eclectic or more traditionally eastern.

I would say a rather academic work of no great importance, even if the image is not sufficiently detailed to give such a bad judgment with ease....

Only local historians could tell the real story of that statue and church.


Last edited by Bruno Giordan on Sat 08 Dec, 2007 2:03 am; edited 1 time in total
Rodolfo Martínez wrote:
Thanks guys, and, What do you think about this Icon?
I don´t know its age.


Icons are the typical expression of the byzantine view of art.

it detaches bluntly from the western christian art because it doesn't look for a faithful reproduction of bodies and things, shunning any technical improvement over perspective: it has to be a tool for praying, not a work of art conveying a sense of proportion and beauty.

The icon you show is modern, the model is ancient since because of the said attitude byzantine art must stay equal to itself forever.

Since the times of Giotto we western europeans sharply deviated from this rigid teocratic view of art, starting the renaissance revolution, which had the sense of beauty and proportion at its core.
Re: What type of armour is wearing?
Rodolfo Martínez wrote:
Hello guys.

This is some kind of statue in Kiev. I guess its armour is someking of medieval Russian or Greek one, but i have no idea.
Do you know if this type of armour really existed, when, hw they were employed and how they were made?

Statue 20 centuries. To history a little relation has.

Archangel Michael.
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-27-1140596174.jpg
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-27-1140596233.jpg
Tver, early 14 century.
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-27-1147846502.jpg
Tret'yakovskaya Gallery, 13 century.
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-27-1150214223.jpg

St. Feodor from Fedorovskogo of Gospel, early 14 century.
http://photofile.ru/photo/shinji-baka/284704/large/5297031.jpg

St. Evstafiy, Novgorod, middle 12 centuries.
http://www.tforum.info/iB_html/uploads/post-2...ovg_12.jpg

St. George, Icon 14 century.
http://ft.fotoplenka.ru/ft/90/99/79990/152022/e588e067.jpg

Vladimir, Dmitrievskiy cathedral
Reliefs. A border is 12-13 ages
http://www.tforum.info/forum/index.php?act=mo...p;album=28

Fresco of "Three riders", Eski-kermen, Crimea
Dated: middle 13 are middles 14 centuries
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-27-1145139981.jpg

«George is in life», early 14 century.
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-27-1147813477.jpg
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-27-1147814412.jpeg

Lvov
13 century.
http://forum.milua.org/files/ukrainian_knights3_268.jpg
15 century
http://forum.milua.org/files/ukrainian_knight...rs_169.jpg
St. George, center 15 century
http://forum.milua.org/files/ukrainian_knights2_70.jpg
http://forum.milua.org/files/ukrainian_knights1_179.jpg

http://mmedia.nsu.ru/anbook/CGI/BROKER.EXE?EL...NTERFACE_E
http://tforum.info//forum/uploads/post-172-1191815931.jpg
http://bgphoto.net/Photos.aspx?UserId=4586&AlbumId=72499
Dan Howard wrote:
M. Eversberg II wrote:
Looks sort of like that leather armour I've seen on some Roman figures.

M.

There is no evidence for leather armour on any Roman figures.


Forgot my Hollywood*

Was referencing Gladiator, ment to add more, went off to find some info and forgot to come back.

M.
Re: What type of armour is wearing?
Rodolfo Martínez wrote:
Hello guys.

This is some kind of statue in Kiev. I guess its armour is someking of medieval Russian or Greek one, but i have no idea.
Do you know if this type of armour really existed, when, hw they were employed and how they were made?


Thank you.

P.D.
I have seen similar armours in greek icons too.
Just if anyone knows, Do you know if there is any Saint Michael Archangel´s paint or WOODCUT :D , with a maximilian armour from XVI century?[/img]


Rodolfo,
In answer to your question about archangel saint michael, im not sure on paintings or woodcuts but i know there is an incredible golden statue of him in a full what looks like gothic harness, with a halo-like piece around his head, he his holding his sword and standing on a rock.
Im pretty sure its on display in St. Mont Michel in france, last time we went to go have a look they had a security problem and no one was allowed in, so unfortunately i have never seen it in the flesh, but from pictures it looks very detailed and may give very good ideas about the armour.
Unfortunately i could not find a photo on the WWW, i will try and find the picture, photocopy it and post it but finding it may be hard.
I hope this helps abit but im pretty sure its not xvi century more like the latter half of the xv cent.
If you do some digging about you may find a good picture of the statue.
Thanks to all guys.
Anyway, i think they( Byzantines) did a great work with their icons, i guess its not easy to paint or do a lamellar armour.
By the way, i have some weird-looking images here to share and the ilanese armoured Michael.


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st_archangel_Michael.gif


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Pietro Perugino ArchangelMichael.jpg


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Saint Michael.gif


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stmichaelicon.jpg


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demetrius1.jpg
Saint Demetrius...

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lucifer.jpg
A weird Lucifer woodcut....

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michael1.jpg


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Saint George slaying the dragon.jpg

Here there are some more Saint Michael, Saint George and other images.


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Saint George Slaying the dragon2.jpg


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stgeorge2.jpg


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saint-George.jpg


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Saint_George_Icon.gif


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Byzantine soldier.jpg


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Saint_Michael_Icon.jpg
i think it is a modern icon, but it looks nice...

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ratnik7.JPG
Some kind of warrior saint...
Hello again guys.
A friend borrowed me Osprey´s Byzantine armies 1118-1461 and i have seen some byzantine men-at-arms.
Do you know where can i get any image of real people wearing the byzantine steel lamellar armour as their men-at-arms did (With the sleeves, skirt,etc...)

Thanks
Rodolfo Martínez wrote:
Do you know where can i get any image of real people wearing the byzantine steel lamellar armour as their men-at-arms did (With the sleeves, skirt,etc...)


Try this: http://www.levantia.com.au/military/armour.html
Thanks Lafayette! Those images are wonderful.
I have seen very few lamellar suits but, i have some doubts about that lamellar armour, Do you know if they really used that type of small ¨pauldrons¨ over the lamellar sleeves?

Thanks.
Hello people!
take a look at this painting

http://www.wilsonsalmanac.com/images2/michael_by_raphael1.jpg

Do you think he could be wearing Maximilian armour with any kind of bases, surcoat, or whatever?

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