David,

That is interesting. I suppose it could be drawn so to show composite bows but it might also be done to represent yew with the sap and heart wood. I have heard rumours of recurve yew self bows before but nothing reliable which would be the one main issue with assuming them yew self bows.

Interesting woodcut for sure.

RPM

After more thought on the subject. I think that these accounts are not an exaggeration. If these writers were triing to make the Irish out to be tougher than they actually were, to make the English look good for beating them, then they wouldnt say that the Irish were extraordinarily skilled with darts and javalins, but say that they were "More Noisesome, especially to the Horse, than deadly". Lets not forget that the dart was the primary missile weapon in Ireland, seconded by throwing rocks and insults ;) .

Hi Randall,

You make a good point. While the bows are clearly recurved, the factors that suggest laminates could also point to yew self bows (although I've not run into yew recurves before). Fascinating discussion!

An additional note. After a second glance, I am not sure whether the Dürer woodcut (below) does suggest composite construction... I seem to see a line which could suggest laminates, but then it could be the sap line between back and belly, or even shadow. On the other hand the line might not be there at all. I don't suppose anyone has a higher definition pic?

Thoughts would be appreciated.

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To me, the bow in the hunting scene above looks to be reflex rather than recurve, meaning that the arms of the bow are strongly curved away from the archer when unstrung, while recurve bow arms only curve away at the tips. Im not sure if yew selfbows could take the forces exerted on a reflex bow but mabye someone with more knowlage of bows could help us with that.

Thanks for the distinction, Stephen. I had always thought of "reflex" as falling under the broader category of "recurve," but this might just be verbal sloppiness on my part.

David,

I do not see a line from top to bottom on the Durer work but many pictures of selfbows would exclude the coloration. I have seen that picture in the past. Its interesting because the bow is not really that big I do not think.

Stephen,

I am not sure how to tell if it was recurve or reflex. To me it rather looks like just the upper arms are curved alone. I do not know if yew could be made reflux though but I will ask around a few bowyers working with it and see. I know recurves are possible with yew now adays but with period sources on if it was used is more or less limited to artwork and possible artists creativity.

RPM

Thanks again Lafeyette for another great article.

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With the same power?" I can't see any mentions of that--what I read in there was that the Irish bow was half the size of the English bow but could shoot as far. This is by no means unusual and wouldn't require a bow of equal strength to the English ones either; maybe the Irish simply used lighter arrows, which naturally would have flown farther. After all, there's no mention whatsoever of how effective these bows were against the English troops, right?

That is a good point, I had not thought of that.

From what I read those short bows were attributed to welsh archers and there are no bows from archeology that can definitely be attributed to the Native Irish. I wouldnt discount anything because its not found in the archeological record as finds are fairly rare in Ireland.

I agree, you are right to be a bit suspicious of these illustrations as sometimes the artist had only someone else's discription to go by and like in the above texts if a bow is discribed as looking saracen then thats what he'll draw.

With regard to this helmet would the original have had some kind of leather liner? Or would it have been worn with just an arming cap underneath?

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Kevin

I would say that it depends how you interpret the mail around the neck.

IMO if the mail is a coif, then an arming cap is worn under the coif and the helm has a leather suspension system to hold it in the right place.

But if the mail is a camail or bishops mantle then padding would be glued into the helm fullfilling the roles of both arming cap and suspension system.

I personally would go with the first choise as I think he is wearing a coif.