Hi William

I thought that this pdf lnk may be of interest to you.

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&am...mp;cad=rja

or if this link does not work try this link where the pdf is available to download.

http://www.medievalists.net/2008/09/25/the-bi...l-society/

and here noting the remarks on contact with Magyars

http://www.shmm.se/Documents/forskning/charlo...tation.pdf

best
Dave
ps if you do see Pete Beatson please send my regards

Well, from what I gather about the terms for a danish/saxon/norse soldier in the employ of a earl or king:

Norwegian:
Hird - A term that emcompasses all of the warriors in the employ of the Noble
Hirdmann - The highest ranking members of the Hird, another norse term for this could be heiðþegar.
Gestir - A lower rank of the Hird
Huscarl - Can be part of the Hird, but a bit fuzzy as to classification. Generally just means a freeman in the employ of the King, could be a warrior, farmhand,et. etc.

Danish - himthige, heimþegi, hlid are all retainers that were part of a Danish lords hirð, lid or drótt, the first names being the equivalent of the norse Hirdmann, the second group werethe equivalant of the general Hird.

Here is some other norse information to add more confusion:

Quote:

Hrólfs saga Gautrekssonar is a Scandinavian legendary saga which was put to text in Iceland in the 13th century. It has a prequel in Gautreks saga.

Quote:

It was also the residence of a much earlier Swedish princess in Hrólfs saga Gautrekssonar: Konungr mælti: "Frétt hefi ek, at hún er bæði vitr ok væn, ok svá er mér flutt, at svá sé hún stór ok stolt, at hún vili, at engi maðr kvenkenni hana ok hún sé tekin til konungs yfir þriðjung Svíþjóðar ok hennar atseta sé á Ullarakri ok haldi þar hirð sem aðrir konungar

Quote:

In Uppsala ruled Erik, the king of Sweden, who had only had one daughter, Þornbjörg. She was a shieldmaiden who would rather spend her days fighting and doing male sports instead of female activities. Due to this behaviour she was called Þórbergr konungr, king Thorberg. Her father gave her the royal estate of Ulleråker, where she kept a retinue of housecarls who helped her chase away undesirable suitors.

Quation here is is the term "housecarls" used in the saga as warriors? Or is it this interpretation that names these followers housecarls when they may have been referrred to as otherwise in the saga?

It seems we are looking at some rather broad terminolgy for the term housecarl, certainly a freeman in the voluntary service of a lord/king, though exaclty what services were provided can greatly vary.

And of course we have the Saxon Huscarl, which is one of the batter known Huscarl terminologies due to the Saxon Royal Huscarls and their involvement at Hastings and Stamford Bridge.

These were clearly elite warriors, but the Danelaw and post Danelaw Saxon terms seem a bit of a bastardization of both Danish and Saxon terms.

Seems like the topic has moved on, but when Matthew was quoting the law about the weapon-thing, he mentioned that a broad axe was a substitute for a sword, my question is what was the original translation, was it perhaps simply axe or did it specify a type?

I think it would be cool to see a kit of a "lower class" Viking incorporate a spear head of a more rudamentary shape such as the cones or larger "arrow head" forms we see in the Viking and early middle ages.

This might be a nice contrast to the typical leaf form viking spears we often see and might help contribute to the image of a lower class Viking.

Just a thought.

Spear shape depends on which part of the period you are reenacting. Remember that the viking age is 300 years long.
In the early period, frankish style winged spearheads are fashionable. In the 10th century, long, slender spearheads with a almost square cross section are favored.
These are replaced by shorter, broader types in the 11th c.

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Pettersen type B. Early period frankish style. [ Download ]

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Pettersen type K. Late period "feather" spear. [ Download ]

Hi William

P.M. sent.

best regards
Dave

I have to admit I approach a lot of the statements about the Vikings being this or that or adhering to this set of laws or the Sagas say this or that with a lot of caution. On one hand I'm fairly sure these statements were true in a given time and place but that doesn't make them universally true all the time everywhere. Did Swedish Vikings adhere to Norwegian law? When? When they were in Norway? Probably. What if they weren't in Norway? What about Danes or Orkneymen? If Swedes were raiding the eastern coast of the Baltic and trading and slaving into Finland, Karelia, Poland, Lithuania and Russia do you think they were tossing and turning in their sleep over Norwegian law? Some sources say they made regular trading runs into Spain and sold slaves and traded there. Is it reasonable to expect them to have the same mind set as Icelanders? Sometimes people talk as though they think there was some kind of Viking handbook. I'm pretty sure that there were never any Viking merit badges!

I'm not trying to pick on anyone but a generalization gets tossed around and soon becomes an almosy universaly accepted fact. Vikings wore horned helmets. That one will never die. Vikings were pagans. Well, not all of them, not always, not everywhere. Vikings were raiders, Yes, sometimes. Vikings were traders. Yes some traded. Vikings were settlers. Yes, sometimes they did that too. The Viking sphere was huge, the Viking culture was vast and stretched across a huge area and was dominant in those areas for three or four hundred years or even longer if you include the Vendal period. Vikings had many cultural things in common but there were huge differences too depending on when and where one is talking about.