Info Favorites Register Log in
myArmoury.com Discussion Forums

Forum index Memberlist Usergroups Spotlight Topics Search
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Hilting a moat blade - Squire/princeDIY Project Reply to topic
 
Author Message
Julien M




Usergroups: 
Donating Members

Location: Paris
Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 833
PostPosted: Sat 28 Apr, 2012 3:01 am    Post subject: Hilting a moat blade - Squire/prince         Reply with quote

Hi all,

As my yeoman project below is currently on hold because I can't find an effective way to drill through 1 cm of mild steel for a peen block (yeah, simple things can delay completion for month in my world Happy ), I decided to start working on another blade, the squire, which I was lucky enough to grab from the moat, as a second blade (again, pristine though I will regrind the tip to a needle).

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=21636

For the yeoman, I went all the way for the cross guard, from anvil to grinder. I took a long time and efforts to get it right, so I decided to allow myself a shortcut here, and ordered a bunch of hilt components form Armour Class as they are UK based.

My intention was to rework most on the anvil/grinder, but to use these as a base, the idea being to spare me some painful steps such as punching the tang slot on the anvil etc...(Though some might say I could invest in a drill press...).

I ordered a pommel an 3 crosses. All serviceable and quiet nice but they will need some work to match the precision and finish of an Albion blade (the tang slot is not centered, and the guard much too thick for an Albion).

As soon as I took this guard out of the box, I knew it would be a good fit for the squire, and to be fair, the pommel is adequate as well for a type XVI sword. After some time filing the tang slot, there it is below.

My initial idea what to go for the Copenhagen sword below, which I always liked, but to be fair, I like the ecusson area of the current cross and will likely keep it as it is. It is possible that this time I'll take the easy route without complicating things too much.

So next I will round the pommel and tweak it to adjust weight, will also need to fill the sides of the tang slot with a dab of weld (one thing I don't like is a squarish recess for the blade) then create the blade recess and thin the cross. Then I will even it and fine tune its geometry to match the aesthetic of the blade. Then the usual: grip, leather, scabbard done Happy I'm really excited about this sword and glad to have reached that stage of completion with so little efforts.

Let me know what you think!

J




View user's profile Send private message
JE Sarge




PostPosted: Sat 28 Apr, 2012 6:29 am    Post subject: Re: Hilting a moat blade - Squire/prince         Reply with quote

Looks great, man. I always enjoy seeing your work! Big Grin


Julien M wrote:
Hi all,

As my yeoman project below is currently on hold because I can't find an effective way to drill through 1 cm of mild steel for a peen block...



In the past, I have taken a steel nut from the hardware store and just ground, filed, and sanded it down. If you get the correct size, you can make it square or any other shape you desire. This prevents from having to drill a hole as well (I don't have a drill press either).

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
View user's profile Send private message
Randall Moffett




Usergroups: None

Location: Sunny Southern California
Reading list: 5 books
Posts: 1,906
PostPosted: Sat 28 Apr, 2012 6:30 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looks really nice! I will have to keep my eyes open for their next moat sale. That said I have intentions to buy some of their bare blades some day as well and make a sword.

Angle grinders are a super useful tool. I have to say I have found it useful around the house as well butting bolts and such down.

Everything looks good so far and lined up. What is your plan for the grip and such? Do you have a design for he grip itself, barrelled or the likes?

RPM
View user's profile Send private message
Julien M




Usergroups: 
Donating Members

Location: Paris
Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 833
PostPosted: Mon 30 Apr, 2012 7:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks guys, glad you like it.

JE Sarge wrote:
In the past, I have taken a steel nut from the hardware store and just ground, filed, and sanded it down. If you get the correct size, you can make it square or any other shape you desire. This prevents from having to drill a hole as well (I don't have a drill press either).


Yeah I've played with that idea as well (for repeening a gen 2 henry V sword...also in the works!). Never finalized anything with it though, and I want this one to be rounded at the base too and that rules out the nut solution I'll ask Owen (bush) to explain why my 2mm drill bits do little more than scratching the surface before breaking in a blitz of swearing on my end...I use a bit made for metal, at slow speed, with loats of oil, so don't get it really.

Randall Moffett wrote:
I will have to keep my eyes open for their next moat sale. That said I have intentions to buy some of their bare blades some day as well and make a sword.RPM


If they ever have another one! I have bought a single handed type XVIII from their bare blade shop as well...very nice but crude compare to the next gen blades I got through the moat...a bit of work will be needed.

Randall Moffett wrote:
What is your plan for the grip and such?RPM


plain and simple leather over cord.

Cheers,

J
View user's profile Send private message
Robert Rytel




Usergroups: None

Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 32
PostPosted: Mon 30 Apr, 2012 8:34 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Julien M wrote:
I'll ask Owen (bush) to explain why my 2mm drill bits do little more than scratching the surface before breaking in a blitz of swearing on my end...I use a bit made for metal, at slow speed, with loats of oil, so don't get it really.


Have you tried a quality cobalt or titanium coated split point bit? Most plain HSS bits at home improvment stores are brittle Chinese junk.
View user's profile Send private message
Leo Todeschini




PostPosted: Mon 30 Apr, 2012 5:26 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Great work as ever Julien.

Quote:
Yeah I've played with that idea as well (for repeening a gen 2 henry V sword...also in the works!). Never finalized anything with it though, and I want this one to be rounded at the base too and that rules out the nut solution I'll ask Owen (bush) to explain why my 2mm drill bits do little more than scratching the surface before breaking in a blitz of swearing on my end...I use a bit made for metal, at slow speed, with loats of oil, so don't get it really.


The bit cuts as a function of its edge speed. So the smaller the bit the faster you need to run it and inversely true. Most DIY drills will kill bits over about 5-6mm because they run far too fast and they burn up. A 2mm bit is pretty small though, so try running your drill at full speed and you won't be too far wrong; you need a steady hand too. Try bracing the drill against your body to hold it steady. Also if the block was a piece of steel picked up at Owens, it could be medium or high carbon, so that could also explain it. - Definitely mild?

Tod

www.todsstuff.co.uk
www.theenglishcutler.co.uk
www.todsfoundry.co.uk
www.todmedia.co.uk
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Julien M




Usergroups: 
Donating Members

Location: Paris
Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 833
PostPosted: Wed 02 May, 2012 2:50 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks Leo and Robert for the comments and tips.

Yes there is a stong possibility I might be trying to drill trough a piece of spring steel...I'll buy a cobalt bit online and will give it a last shot maybe...or by then I will have had access to a drill press, or will just peen the damn thing as it is, bare pommelled and coutersicked.


Cheers,

J
View user's profile Send private message
Randall Moffett




Usergroups: None

Location: Sunny Southern California
Reading list: 5 books
Posts: 1,906
PostPosted: Wed 02 May, 2012 5:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

You might want to make a stand or jig for the drill to sit in while you drill. Unless you think the torque is going to jerk the drill around a simple unit with two vertical boards and a support behind it will guide the drill up and down. Just put the boards close enough the drills back can nestle inside it. This will keep it steady.

RPM
View user's profile Send private message
Sean Flynt
myArmoury Team


myArmoury Team

PostPosted: Wed 02 May, 2012 12:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I usually just use modified mild steel hex nuts or wing nuts for such blocks. You can easily form donut-shaped blocks from hex nuts or inverted cones or floral blocks from the wing nuts. Very handy! Just be sure to get a size slightly smaller than the tang because you'll probably want to file out the threads. And make sure you don't pick up stainless, of course, because they'll give you a heart attack trying to mod them like this.
-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Sean Flynt
myArmoury Team


myArmoury Team

PostPosted: Wed 02 May, 2012 12:49 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

A gallery of reborn hex nuts! The black hilt sports an inverted wingnut (sans wings, of course) and the Type XIV has a block made from a bit of cheap stock (that's the battered Sculpy model atop the piece that became the block).


 Attachment: 64.9 KB, Viewed: 1446 times
pommel_427.gif


 Attachment: 111.7 KB, Viewed: 1446 times
pommel_164.gif


 Attachment: 144.92 KB, Viewed: 1446 times
download_119.gif


 Attachment: 143.61 KB, Viewed: 1446 times
download-5_345.gif


 Attachment: 169.18 KB, Viewed: 1446 times
block_207.gif


 Attachment: 197.48 KB, Viewed: 1446 times
hilt_163.gif


 Attachment: 72.39 KB, Viewed: 1446 times
xivtop_940.gif


-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Sean Flynt
myArmoury Team


myArmoury Team

PostPosted: Wed 02 May, 2012 1:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

By the way, these mods go easier if you screw the nut onto a bolt. The bolt gives you something to hold in the hand or vise. If the bolt head gets in the way you just reverse the nut and work on the unhindered side. You can even insert the bolt into your drill like a bit and do the polishing by simply running the drill while holding a sanding sponge or paper against the block (only for rounded blocks, of course).

I typically leave the top of the block roughly finished because I file and sand the peen anyway. Blending peen and block requires doing that whole top surface together.

Another tip: The mild steel block I made for the Type XIV drilled easily but you should cut the blank longer than you need, drill and THEN do the faceting/shaping. Drilling a finished piece is much dicier, as it will be obvious if you're even a few mm off center. Shaping the piece to the hole is much more forgiving. You probably already know that drilling a small pilot hole makes everything much easier. I use hand-drill bits rated for stainless steel, and they go right through pommel-size pieces of mild steel without any trouble at all. You need a solid bench and vise, though, because you have to lean into the drill.

-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Julien M




Usergroups: 
Donating Members

Location: Paris
Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 833
PostPosted: Thu 03 May, 2012 3:19 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nice work above Sean.

The hex nut method obviously works well for round/oval peen blocks.
For this one I want to drill through that thing, and won't rest until I succeed! Happy
The peen I have in mind for the Yeoman should flare on both sides, making it rectangular.

J
View user's profile Send private message
Jason Mather




PostPosted: Thu 03 May, 2012 7:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

You could try to anneal it. Heat it up good and red, then quickly push it into wood ash or vermiculite. If its tool/spring steel that should do it. When you drill it, use 3-5 different sizes and step them up to the final size you are after.
To be nobody but yourself in a world that's doing its best to make you somebody else, is to fight the hardest battle you are ever going to fight. Never stop fighting.
View user's profile Send private message


Display posts from previous:   
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Hilting a moat blade - Squire/princeDIY Project
Page 1 of 1 Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 8 Hours

View previous topic :: View next topic
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum






All contents © Copyright 2003-2013 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum