myArmoury.com - Cold Steel Grosse Messer

Posts: 199 Location: Leeds, UK

Fri 07 Mar, 2008 12:41 pm

Cold Steel Grosse Messer

Hi All,

I have just bought what was advertised as a Cold Steel Grosse Messer. Upon arrival however, I discover that it doesn't have a slab tang - the wood sandwiches the tang and meets where the tang should be visible.

I'm a tad disappointed by this, and automatically assumed that I had been sold a dud. However, every other aspect of the sword seems accurate. What I was wondering was: does anyone know if there was a generation of Grosse Messers by Cold Steel that didn't have the slab tang, or if anyone has encountered this before?

I bought this in advance of the UK sword ban where after 6th April it will be illegal for me to purchase. Therefore I would rather send it back for a refund sooner rather than later.

Thanks in advance for any comments!

Ant

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Joel Chesser

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Posts: 724 Location: Oklahoma

Fri 07 Mar, 2008 3:34 pm

Hi there. I have a Cold Grosse messer that I purchased a couple of years ago from Kult of Athena. The grip on mine is exactly the same. The sword has not had any problems as far as I can tell and seems to be as tight and sound as the day it arrived. The only cutting it has done was a pumpkin a few Halloweens ago. Since then only dry swinging has been done, but I have not seen anything that would make me worried and, due the swords dubious past, I have looked.
Check out this link
http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t...sse+messer
The first page has some information about the possiblity of cold steel changing manufacturers and the first post on the second page has a good review by someone who has this sword and put it through the ringer.
I hope this help some .

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Ant Mercer

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Posts: 199 Location: Leeds, UK

Sat 08 Mar, 2008 2:42 pm

Hey Joel,

Thanks for your reply, it's good to hear that my hilt isn't totally unusual! I've also read a post on SFI which mentioned this design as due to it being a 2nd Gen pattern. Glad to hear it hasn't been to the detriment of your sword's performance at least.
I was also wondering if this wrap-around-wood-type-grip is historically accurate. To me, one of the defining characteristics of a messer is the slab-grip - does anyone know how common it was to find examples of ones without it?

Cheers,

Ant

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John Love

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Posts: 10 Location: Ipswich UK

Sat 08 Mar, 2008 3:29 pm

Re: Cold Steel Grosse Messer

Ant Mercer wrote:

Hi All,

I bought this in advance of the UK sword ban where after 6th April it will be illegal for me to purchase. Therefore I would rather send it back for a refund sooner rather than later.

Ant

I realise this is a bit off-topic but as Ant has mentioned it I thought I would try to clarify the rules regarding the sale of swords that comes into effect in the UK in April.

Justice Minister Cathy Jamieson announced laws to ban swords unless sold for legitimate reasons. Shops selling swords will need a licence, as will businesses dealing with non-domestic knives and other bladed weapons such as machetes. Exemptions to the ban on sword sales include swords that are to be used for Highland dancing, museum displays, historical re-enactments, fencing and martial arts.

This law appears to have been pushed through because of a few gangs of teenagers fighting with cheap mail-order Samurai swords. The annoying thing is it will have as little effect on crime as the UK hand-gun ban did in 1996.

My apologies for straying off-topic, please move this to a more appropriate forum if required.

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Corey D. Sullivan

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Posts: 73 Location: Canada

Sat 08 Mar, 2008 6:30 pm

Re: Cold Steel Grosse Messer

John Love wrote:

Ant Mercer wrote:

Hi All,

I bought this in advance of the UK sword ban where after 6th April it will be illegal for me to purchase. Therefore I would rather send it back for a refund sooner rather than later.

Ant

I realise this is a bit off-topic but as Ant has mentioned it I thought I would try to clarify the rules regarding the sale of swords that comes into effect in the UK in April.

Justice Minister Cathy Jamieson announced laws to ban swords unless sold for legitimate reasons. Shops selling swords will need a licence, as will businesses dealing with non-domestic knives and other bladed weapons such as machetes. Exemptions to the ban on sword sales include swords that are to be used for Highland dancing, museum displays, historical re-enactments, fencing and martial arts.

This law appears to have been pushed through because of a few gangs of teenagers fighting with cheap mail-order Samurai swords. The annoying thing is it will have as little effect on crime as the UK hand-gun ban did in 1996.

My apologies for straying off-topic, please move this to a more appropriate forum if required.

Great. So it's all swords now, not just "samurai swords"? Just peachy.

Anyhow, back on topic. If your messer doesn't have a slab tang with riveted grip scales,does that mean that it is no longer a messer? Not that Cold Steel's was much of a messer to begin with...

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Chad Arnow

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Posts: 9,545 Location: Dayton, OH

Sat 08 Mar, 2008 8:09 pm

There are multiple threads in the Off-Topic forum that deal with the proposed ban in the UK. Please discuss this issue there.

Thank you.

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Joel Chesser

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Posts: 724 Location: Oklahoma

Sat 08 Mar, 2008 10:24 pm

I have looking around the internet and this site trying to locate historical examples of this grip type. The closest I've been able to find are these two images. One is a replica by Lutel, the other a historical piece I found in the album of this website.
The Lutel piece I feel pretty sure has no visible tang, the second I'm not quite sure about as the the angle makes it a little difficult to tell, but I would be tempted say it also has no visible tang. Again, I'm not 100% sure, so any information contradictory or otherwise would be great.

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