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Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Looking for evidence of 6mm rings for viking period. Reply to topic
 
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Reece Nelson




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Location: Overland Park KS
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PostPosted: Thu 13 Mar, 2014 2:20 pm    Post subject: Looking for evidence of 6mm rings for viking period.         Reply with quote

Hello all,

I've recently been looking for evidence for mail in 6mm rings that would be documented for the viking age. Very soon I will have a 6mm hauberk for my early 15th century kit, but wanted to see if there was any evidence that suggested if it was used during that period.

I had spoken with William Short from Hurstwic about this and he had said he had documented it, but can't find his notes and that it'll be some time.

The link to Hurstwics page.
http://www.hurstwic.com/history/articles/manu...g_mail.htm

So, if anyone has any information on this that would be greatly appreciated Big Grin

-Reece
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Kai Lawson




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Location: Madison, WI
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Posts: 337
PostPosted: Thu 13 Mar, 2014 6:45 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Are your 6mm links measured from the inside or the outside of the ring? Most listed 6mm rings are actually around 7-8mm, as the manufacturer measures the diameter from the inside of the ring. Most museums and collections will list measurements from the outside of the ring, so a 6mm hauberk in a museum might have an inner diameter of 4mm or so.

As for references, there are many knowledgable forumites about who can list links to useful webpages and .pdf documents; I tend to just download the documents and forget the links...

"And they crossed swords."
--William Goldman, alias S. Morgenstern
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Luka Borscak




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Location: Croatia
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PostPosted: Fri 14 Mar, 2014 2:58 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here you have some examples: http://www.vikingsonline.org.uk/resources/authenticity/chainmail/
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Bartek Strojek




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Location: Poland
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PostPosted: Fri 14 Mar, 2014 3:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

http://members.ozemail.com.au/~chrisandpeter/mail/birka_mail.htm

Here they list quite a bit of 6mm and smaller rings, as far as inside diameter goes.

If that's what you mean, doesn't seem that there were any as small as 6mm of external diameter in Birka.
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Reece Nelson




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Location: Overland Park KS
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Posts: 254
PostPosted: Sat 29 Mar, 2014 7:09 pm    Post subject: need evidence of 6mm rings viking age         Reply with quote

Kai Lawson wrote:
Are your 6mm links measured from the inside or the outside of the ring? Most listed 6mm rings are actually around 7-8mm, as the manufacturer measures the diameter from the inside of the ring. Most museums and collections will list measurements from the outside of the ring, so a 6mm hauberk in a museum might have an inner diameter of 4mm or so.

As for references, there are many knowledgable forumites about who can list links to useful webpages and .pdf documents; I tend to just download the documents and forget the links...


Inner diameter, yes.

-Reece
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Kai Lawson




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Location: Madison, WI
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PostPosted: Sat 29 Mar, 2014 7:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Wow! Looking at the charts, some of those hauberks must have been very impressive! 9mm external measurements with almost 2mm wire? That, and the Gjermundbu shirt have some beefy links
"And they crossed swords."
--William Goldman, alias S. Morgenstern
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Dan Howard




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Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia
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PostPosted: Sat 29 Mar, 2014 8:07 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The measurements of the links today may not have any relation to the size of the links when they were first made. Iron can increase to more than twice its volume as it oxidises.
Author: Bronze Age Military Equipment, Pen and Sword Books
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Bartek Strojek




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Location: Poland
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PostPosted: Sun 30 Mar, 2014 8:01 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Dan Howard wrote:
The measurements of the links today may not have any relation to the size of the links when they were first made. Iron can increase to more than twice its volume as it oxidises.



This factor will undoubtedly kind of ruin the statistics, but fortunately there are preserved rings, like Gjermundbu ones that seem rather superficiality oxidised.
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Dan Howard




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Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia
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PostPosted: Sun 30 Mar, 2014 1:49 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bartek Strojek wrote:
Dan Howard wrote:
The measurements of the links today may not have any relation to the size of the links when they were first made. Iron can increase to more than twice its volume as it oxidises.


This factor will undoubtedly kind of ruin the statistics, but fortunately there are preserved rings, like Gjermundbu ones that seem rather superficiality oxidised.

They are in the minority. All of the sites that describe extant examples of mail with the link measurements are useless unless they also describe the degree of oxidation. Any meaningful analysis has to start by removing the examples that are heavily oxidised. That is frustrating during the time in question because we have so few examples to start with.

Author: Bronze Age Military Equipment, Pen and Sword Books
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