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Richard Fay
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 Posted: Mon 13 Nov, 2006 11:55 am Post subject: |
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Hello all!
| Crispin Yingst wrote: |
Could it be possible that the surcoat would be made out of some kind of leather? |
Crispin,
Probably not! Period artwork that depicts the surcoat always shows it as a freely-flowing garment, usually with lots of folds in the fabric. It has already been mentioned that the surcoat in the 13th century was often made out of fairly thin material.
Claude Blair, in European Armour circa 1066 to circa 1700, states that the surcoat was a fabric garment.
In Archaeology of Weapons, Ewart Oakeshott mentions that it could be made out of rich material; period inventories speak of surcoats made of velvet and samite.
In European Arms and Armour, Charles Henry Ashdown mentions other rich materials used for the surcoat. He states that it could be made of silk, embroidered with gold and sometimes decorated with precious stones. Cloth of gold was also used.
In English Medieval Knight 1200-1300, Christopher Gravett defines a military surcoat as a cloth garment worn over armour.
Now, a torso protection known as a cuirie or quiret was sometimes worn beneath the surcoat in the 13th and early 14th centuries. This is believed to have been made from leather (from the root cuir, meaning leather or hide). It was either shaped or hardened leather, sometimes reinforced with metal plates or disks. It was either strapped or laced over the hauberk.
The surcoat itself occasionally bore rectangular plates in the torso region, to form a simple coat-of-plates (as seen on the sculpture of a sleeping guard from a reliquary at Wienhausen, Germany, and "St. Maurice" from a painted wooden panel of a reliquary in the Monastery at Logum, Denmark). Sometimes, a coat-of-plates could be worn in place of a more traditional surcoat, and included "flaps" down the front and back, like that seen on the statue of St. Maurice from Magdeburg Cathedral, or one of the soldiers on the sculpture depicting "The Guardians of the Holy Sepulchre" on the main porch of Strasbourg Cathedral. However, the surcoat itself was of a flowing fabric.
I hope this helped!
Stay safe!
"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did! I'm going to recite poetry!"
Prince Andrew of Armar
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Edward Lee
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| Posted: Sun 19 Apr, 2015 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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I have no doubt that plate is a better protection than mail and mail is an adequate protection with padding. My problem with plate, is that in the pass year I have exchanged two breastplates due to my size change. I got taller and the breastplates got too short. I'm not sure if back then people still wore breastplates even if it's too short for as long as they can bend while wearing it, but for mail I never have to worry about it.
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Dan Howard
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| Posted: Sun 19 Apr, 2015 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Edward Lee wrote: | | I have no doubt that plate is a better protection than mail and mail is an adequate protection with padding. My problem with plate, is that in the pass year I have exchanged two breastplates due to my size change. I got taller and the breastplates got too short. I'm not sure if back then people still wore breastplates even if it's too short for as long as they can bend while wearing it, but for mail I never have to worry about it. |
Munitions plate was specifically made to be adjusted for varying body sizes. Custom plate was altered to accommodate minor changes in shape but it was simply replaced if that wasn't sufficient. The vast majority of the population at the time had body shapes that varied a lot less than today. But there are exceptions: the Royal Armouries recently had an exhibition showing how Henry VIII's armour changed over the years as he grew fatter. If you were a youth and still growing then anyone not of the nobility will likely have hand-me-down armour until they finished filling out.
Keep in mind that anybody actively involved in military campaigns and who trains regularly will not put on weight the way some people do today. They didn't have the ridiculous diet that modern society does either. Once a person reaches their adult size, their body shape is unlikely to change much for decades.
Author: Bronze Age Military Equipment, Pen and Sword Books
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