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Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Patrick Bárta "Bastard" Sword Reply to topic
 
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 11:53 am    Post subject: Patrick Bárta "Bastard" Sword         Reply with quote

I haven't seen this one discussed yet, so I'm posting a photo of it.

It's a recent creation from Patrick Bárta, of TEMPL Historic Arms. It's a 16th century sword modeled after one found at a museum in Vienna, Austria. The maker calls it a bastard sword, but I'd refer to it as a Riding Sword or Reitschwert.

Lovely piece.



This makes me hungry for my next piece from Mr. Bárta.

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Patrick Kelly




PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 12:21 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I absolutely LOVE this one!
"I'd rather go upriver with 7 studs, than a 100 sh!theads." - COL Charlie Beckwith, founder SFODD
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Kenneth Enroth




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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 12:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Patrick Bárta Bastard Sword         Reply with quote

Nathan Robinson wrote:
I haven't seen this one discussed yet, so I'm posting a photo of it.

It's a recent creation from Patrick Bárta, of TEMPL Historic Arms. It's a 16th century bastard sword modeled after one found at a museum in Vienna, Austria.

Lovely piece.
This makes me hungry for my next piece from Mr. Bárta.


That's very nice. What have you ordered?
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 12:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Patrick Bárta Bastard Sword         Reply with quote

Kenneth Enroth wrote:
That's very nice. What have you ordered?

We'll both be surprised. When I work with a custom maker with whom I trust (why work with anyone else?) I just give a general idea of a type of sword, era, etc, and see what comes about.

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Aaron Schnatterly




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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 12:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Patrick Bárta Bastard Sword         Reply with quote

Nathan Robinson wrote:
We'll both be surprised. When I work with a custom maker with whom I trust (why work with anyone else?) I just give a general idea of a type of sword, era, etc, and see what comes about.


I respect that. You have some brass ones, man... but I know how you feel. The smith probably appreciates this approach a bunch, as well. Too many cooks and all that.

Oh, and that Bastard? NICE!

-Aaron Schnatterly
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Gordon Clark




PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 12:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I do love that sword - but I'm wondering how you use it with two hands (isn't that what "bastard" implies?) Would the rapier like guards get in the way of the wrist of hand #2? Having a hard time picturing it.
Gordon
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 1:01 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Good point. Mr. Bárta calls it a bastard sword on his site. I wouldn't. I'd call it a Riding Sword or Reitschwert, myself. I shall edit the topic accordingly.
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Thomas Hoogendam




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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 1:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The detailing is stunning in this piece.

And yeah, it does seem a bit short in the grip to be a bastard. Regardless though, the craftmanship is amazing.
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Kenneth Enroth




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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 1:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Patrick Bárta Bastard Sword         Reply with quote

Nathan Robinson wrote:
Kenneth Enroth wrote:
That's very nice. What have you ordered?

We'll both be surprised. When I work with a custom maker with whom I trust (why work with anyone else?) I just give a general idea of a type of sword, era, etc, and see what comes about.


Sounds like a fun approach. I should try it sometime.
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Paul Mortimer




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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 1:19 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I am sure that you will be pleased with whatever Patrick does with your sword -- if my experience is anything to go by. The man is a gentleman.

Paul
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Patrick Kelly




PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 1:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Patrick Bárta Bastard Sword         Reply with quote

Aaron Schnatterly wrote:
Nathan Robinson wrote:
We'll both be surprised. When I work with a custom maker with whom I trust (why work with anyone else?) I just give a general idea of a type of sword, era, etc, and see what comes about.


I respect that. You have some brass ones, man... but I know how you feel. The smith probably appreciates this approach a bunch, as well. Too many cooks and all that.

Oh, and that Bastard? NICE!


This is the same approach I've always used and I've seldom been disappointed by the results. An artist works much better when they have creative freedom. Choosing a knowledgeable and capable craftsman is much more important than hampering them with a bunch of minute details that are probably wrong anyway.

"I'd rather go upriver with 7 studs, than a 100 sh!theads." - COL Charlie Beckwith, founder SFODD
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Aaron Schnatterly




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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 1:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Patrick Bárta Bastard Sword         Reply with quote

Patrick Kelly wrote:
his is the same approach I've always used and I've seldom been disappointed by the results. An artist works much better when they have creative freedom. Choosing a knowledgeable and capable craftsman is much more important than hampering them with a bunch of minute details that are probably wrong anyway.



That was pretty much my line of thought - just a solid leap of faith when it comes to the ol' pocketbook.

I've gone this route before as well, and also been between happy and overjoyed with the outcome. I was nervous as a long-tailed cat in a room of rocking chairs the whole time. Razz Nathan's response just seemed so calm.

Stepping into the role of craftsman, I would really appreciate the opportunity to work with the lattitude afforded by Nathan - "In general, I would like something like this (vague discription). I trust you." and go after it. I could do a lot better work working within my own inspiration that I could by someone's napkin-sketch expectation.

-Aaron Schnatterly
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Nate C.




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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 10:14 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sweet! Eek! Big Grin Big Grin Cool

I intend to get my own of this type one day. I would call it a German basket hilt myself. It's one of the most elegant baskets IMHO (sorry Mac Razz ). I've always been partial to this one myself. Mr. Barta is definitely on my list of makers to commission a sword from.

Cheers,

Nate C.

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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 10:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nate C. wrote:
I would call it a German basket hilt myself. It's one of the most elegant baskets IMHO

That's what I have on order from TEMPL Happy

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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Tue 24 May, 2005 11:20 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Patrick Kelly wrote:
I absolutely LOVE this one!


I do, too. I wish it was mine! (I bet your'e not surprised by that...)

I wonder who does own it and if he's a forum member.

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Robert W. Betten




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PostPosted: Wed 25 May, 2005 1:06 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

its not my favourite style of swords...but regardless Mr. Barta gets props for his as usual impecible standard of work!!! I'm dying for a dark age sword from him, just that my money is tied up else where. I would really love who ever owns that to do a review for myArmoury, lets hope he stops by this part of the web once in a while. Big Grin
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Daniel Parry




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PostPosted: Wed 25 May, 2005 3:10 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That is very lovely. His work is amazing.

On typology I wonder whether he is calling it a bastard sword according to Oakshott. If you have Oakshott European Weapons & Armour to hand, the illustrations of later bastard swords of Bavarian type on page 130, in particular figures E, F, G, and rings on the modified G1, follow very closely Mr Barta's shape. He seems to describe the terminology 'bastard sword' on the previous page as basically being often used to describe later manifestations of the great sword and not particularly applying to size, and could apply to much smaller swords. I must say I can see his point if you block the swept bars out of your mind and look at the base shape.

He also notes the long pommel of that design, which he says is never usually found on reitschwert or rapiers. So he may be using that as a classification.

I guess it's a difficult classification because if you are mainly interested in later swords, as I am, it almost seems like a prototype rapier-sword (not a pure rapier), and if you are mainly into medieval stuff, it probably doesn't look like a pure bastard sword.

Beautiful piece anyway.

Daniel
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