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Don Stanko
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 Posted: Mon 03 Oct, 2011 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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The release of the Wallace Collection catalog got me thinking about this topic. I'm sure Toby is pretty busy, but does anybody have any information on the progress of this book?
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Job Overbeek
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| Posted: Tue 04 Oct, 2011 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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I'm very curious as well, could you give a little preview or something on what would be in it?
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Nathan F
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| Posted: Mon 17 Oct, 2011 4:26 am Post subject: |
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Pretty sure i PMed you before but i am still interested 
for here starts war carrion birds sing, and grey wolves howl
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Blaz Berlec
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Jean Thibodeau
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| Posted: Mon 17 Oct, 2011 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Blaz Berlec wrote: | I don't know if I'll get into trouble by reposting stuff from Arms and Armour Forum, but Tobias Capwell is now fully committed to finishing his "English Armour" project. It is now a three book set, and the first volume is planned for first half of 2012.
Personally, can't wait, because after that he might do a Continental one.
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First half of 2012 is not that far away.  
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Tobias Capwell
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| Posted: Mon 09 Apr, 2012 1:31 am Post subject: |
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Hi Gang,
Sorry for the long pause in news on the English armour project... Publication work at the museum keeps slowing things down! Museum publications -the Masterpieces book, the digital catalogue, and now the exhibition catalogue to our summer show 'The Noble Art of the Sword: Fashion and Fencing in Renaissance Europe 1520-1630'- have had to take precedence, and its impossible to work on more than one huge publication at a time!
Anyway, I'm nearly clear and am turning my attention back to polishing off the English armour project. You may be interested to know that it will now appear in three volumes:
Volume I: The domestic style in England, 1400-50
Volume II- The domestic style in England, 1450-1500
Volume III- The continental styles, 1400-1500
The third volume really has two functions- first, it offers comparitive material that is vital to the argument that the English style of armour was distinct and different, both artistically and in terms of its practical performance. English armour was different? Different from what? Its important to define all of that. Second, its obviously very important to explore the presence of foreign armour in England. Italian armour in particular. We know there was a lot of it imported into England, but who was buying it? That's a very interesting story in itself and sheds some light on the significance of the domestic style, which tended to be very rich and expensive.
So... Volume I is close to completion and I hope to go into production in June. I will concentrate on getting one volume done and released at a time. My own personal 'Lord of the Rings' trilogy...
As soon as I have any more news I will let you know. Sorry its taking so long.
Best,
Toby
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William P
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| Posted: Mon 09 Apr, 2012 2:45 am Post subject: |
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my interest is in more the continental styles (in particular i am a HUGE fan of gothic armour, anything with a visored sallet..)
but sadly i dont think id be able to justify 100-200 (in the case that the overall price jumps up dramatically for whatever reason) for even 3 books anytime soon.
im wondering what the odds would be of me purchasing the third volume on its own.
i might JUST be able to justify buying one of the volumes.
its funny though , like with cars nowdays while the english have their own, high end design of armour,
iits always overshadowed by the powerhouses of italy and germany.
that said, if christopher gravetts illusatration of what is titled 'english armour' is correct i might ery well change my stance, much in the same way a diehard lamboghini fan one day finally discoveres the jaguar and rolls royce.
(if i might ask you, toby, if you have seen the illustrations of english armour in christophers osprey books, and i wonder if they are an adequate representation of that unique style of english armour you discovered)
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Jojo Zerach
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| Posted: Mon 09 Apr, 2012 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| William P wrote: | my interest is in more the continental styles (in particular i am a HUGE fan of gothic armour, anything with a visored sallet..)
but sadly i dont think id be able to justify 100-200 (in the case that the overall price jumps up dramatically for whatever reason) for even 3 books anytime soon.
im wondering what the odds would be of me purchasing the third volume on its own.
i might JUST be able to justify buying one of the volumes.
its funny though , like with cars nowdays while the english have their own, high end design of armour,
iits always overshadowed by the powerhouses of italy and germany.
that said, if christopher gravetts illusatration of what is titled 'english armour' is correct i might ery well change my stance, much in the same way a diehard lamboghini fan one day finally discoveres the jaguar and rolls royce.
(if i might ask you, toby, if you have seen the illustrations of english armour in christophers osprey books, and i wonder if they are an adequate representation of that unique style of english armour you discovered) |
The illustrations in Christopher Gravetts books do seem to be a fairly accurate interpretation of the effigies of their respective eras.
(I don't think Tobias is claiming he's discovered the English style, just that he's making a book series about it.)
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Raman A
Location: United States Joined: 25 Aug 2011
Posts: 148
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| Posted: Mon 09 Apr, 2012 9:17 am Post subject: |
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so now that its a three volume set, what kind of price are we talking? 200-250 for all three books is something I'd be more than happy to pay, but if its 200 for just a single part of the set then I'm not sure.
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Matt Easton
Location: Surrey, UK. Joined: 30 Jun 2004
Posts: 241
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Greg Mele
Industry Professional
Location: Chicago, IL USA Joined: 20 Mar 2006
Posts: 356
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Artis Aboltins
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| Posted: Mon 09 Apr, 2012 10:48 am Post subject: |
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Excellent news! 3 volumes instead of just one likely means much more information available to us, and that is really something to look forward to. I am curious about the prices for the books too, of course, although, I assume, that it must be impossible to voice a precise numbers now...
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Jean Thibodeau
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| Posted: Mon 09 Apr, 2012 10:51 am Post subject: |
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Ordering information, as soon as possible/practical, for U.S.A. and Canada and obviously for other parts of the World and ballpark prices ?
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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William P
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| Posted: Tue 10 Apr, 2012 8:51 am Post subject: |
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| Jojo Zerach wrote: | | William P wrote: | my interest is in more the continental styles (in particular i am a HUGE fan of gothic armour, anything with a visored sallet..)
but sadly i dont think id be able to justify 100-200 (in the case that the overall price jumps up dramatically for whatever reason) for even 3 books anytime soon.
im wondering what the odds would be of me purchasing the third volume on its own.
i might JUST be able to justify buying one of the volumes.
its funny though , like with cars nowdays while the english have their own, high end design of armour,
iits always overshadowed by the powerhouses of italy and germany.
that said, if christopher gravetts illusatration of what is titled 'english armour' is correct i might ery well change my stance, much in the same way a diehard lamboghini fan one day finally discoveres the jaguar and rolls royce.
(if i might ask you, toby, if you have seen the illustrations of english armour in christophers osprey books, and i wonder if they are an adequate representation of that unique style of english armour you discovered) |
The illustrations in Christopher Gravetts books do seem to be a fairly accurate interpretation of the effigies of their respective eras.
(I don't think Tobias is claiming he's discovered the English style, just that he's making a book series about it.) |
my understanding that he pretty much was the first to recognise the englih harness style (prior to the grenwich style of tudor england of course) as being a distinct style in its own right as opposed to it merely being a variation of the italian style or something
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Jojo Zerach
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| Posted: Tue 10 Apr, 2012 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| William P wrote: | | Jojo Zerach wrote: | | William P wrote: | my interest is in more the continental styles (in particular i am a HUGE fan of gothic armour, anything with a visored sallet..)
but sadly i dont think id be able to justify 100-200 (in the case that the overall price jumps up dramatically for whatever reason) for even 3 books anytime soon.
im wondering what the odds would be of me purchasing the third volume on its own.
i might JUST be able to justify buying one of the volumes.
its funny though , like with cars nowdays while the english have their own, high end design of armour,
iits always overshadowed by the powerhouses of italy and germany.
that said, if christopher gravetts illusatration of what is titled 'english armour' is correct i might ery well change my stance, much in the same way a diehard lamboghini fan one day finally discoveres the jaguar and rolls royce.
(if i might ask you, toby, if you have seen the illustrations of english armour in christophers osprey books, and i wonder if they are an adequate representation of that unique style of english armour you discovered) |
The illustrations in Christopher Gravetts books do seem to be a fairly accurate interpretation of the effigies of their respective eras.
(I don't think Tobias is claiming he's discovered the English style, just that he's making a book series about it.) |
my understanding that he pretty much was the first to recognise the englih harness style (prior to the grenwich style of tudor england of course) as being a distinct style in its own right as opposed to it merely being a variation of the italian style or something |
Using effigies, it is easy for anyone to follow the continuous development of English armour from the 14th century through the 15th century.
I would actually say that as the 15th century progressed, English armour evolved to more closely resemble the continental styles.
(Convergent, rather than divergent evolution, if you will.)
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Kel Rekuta
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| Posted: Tue 10 Apr, 2012 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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No.
If you had read Toby's PhD thesis which these books will be based on, you would not believe that. But you clearly haven't so you will have to wait until the second book in the series comes out to understand why you are mistaken.
@ Jean T. - When Toby first announced his intention to publish the work as a three part series, he made an effort to find the comfort level of affordability for those people most likely interested in the work. By breaking it up into a series published over a couple years, each volume will be affordable to serious amateurs instead of independently wealthy collectors and institutions. IIRC he was targeting under 100 GBP per volume, so perhaps as much as 300 GBP all in. It will become a highly sought collection much like Boccia's books have in the twenty plus years since they were published. Much of the material is ground breaking research and the photos alone should sell anyone serious about the study of late medieval armour.
| Jojo Zerach wrote: |
Using effigies, it is easy for anyone to follow the continuous development of English armour from the 14th century through the 15th century.
I would actually say that as the 15th century progressed, English armour evolved to more closely resemble the continental styles.
(Convergent, rather than divergent evolution, if you will.) |
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William P
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| Posted: Wed 11 Apr, 2012 3:22 am Post subject: |
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i personally see english armour as a 'blended style'
sort of like the harness is made up of the leftovers from two incomplete german and italian harnesses.
like, the breastplate from italian, but the sabatons from a german.. and so on.. but thats just my opinion, and im also probably way oversimplifying it. but thats just how it looks from my perspective,
and as for pricing if its over a few years i think i can work with that. over a period of 3 years or more 300 GBP (or whatever its equivelent in australian dollars is) isnt very much
so im kind of glad its spread out, though since im a gothic armour fan, im mostly waiting for the third one.
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Blaz Berlec
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| Posted: Wed 11 Apr, 2012 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Volume I: The domestic style in England, 1400-50
Volume II- The domestic style in England, 1450-1500
Volume III- The continental styles, 1400-1500
The third volume really has two functions- first, it offers comparitive material that is vital to the argument that the English style of armour was distinct and different, both artistically and in terms of its practical performance. English armour was different? Different from what? Its important to define all of that. |
Yay for the third volume! I'll buy the whole set just for that (since I have very little use of far-off strange armour styles)
Extant 15th Century German Gothic Armour
Extant 15th century Milanese armour
Arming doublet of the 15th century
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Nathan F
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| Posted: Sat 21 Apr, 2012 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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i was just thinking about this a few days ago am hugely excited for this now i need to save i am a huge fan of all of Tobys work and dream of having some of the armour he owns but for now these books would be just as good.
for here starts war carrion birds sing, and grey wolves howl
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Mark T
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| Posted: Thu 23 Aug, 2012 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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Any news on this project? (Sorry if I've missed it in another post; access has been patchy lately.)
Chief Librarian/Curator, Isaac Leibowitz Librarmoury
Schallern sind sehr sexy!
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