Info Favorites Register Log in
myArmoury.com Discussion Forums

Forum index Memberlist Usergroups Spotlight Topics Search
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Funky Viking shield Reply to topic
This is a standard topic Go to page 1, 2  Next 
Author Message
Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Likes: 1 page

Posts: 201

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 3:26 pm    Post subject: Funky Viking shield         Reply with quote

Aparently, this shield is in a museum in Oslo. I have never seen one quite like it. All that iron on the face makes it look rather heavy, unless the strips are thinner than they look on the pic.

Perhaps a ceremonial shield?

Any thougths?

The image is too large to post, aparently. Follow ze link.
View user's profile Send private message
Johan S. Moen




Location: Kristiansand, Norway
Joined: 26 Jan 2004

Posts: 259

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 4:56 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looks like the face of a wagon wheel to me. Even if it is intended for ceremonial use, it just looks way to heavy. Confused

Johan Schubert Moen
View user's profile Send private message
Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
Joined: 17 Aug 2003
Reading list: 42 books

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 5,739

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 5:19 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I tend to agree with Johan. Is it possibly something other than a shield? It sure looks like it.
"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Adam Lloyd




Location: Chicago, IL
Joined: 29 Jan 2004

Posts: 91

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 5:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looks like the home decor shields of the early part of the 20th century
View user's profile Send private message
Greyson Brown




Location: Windsor, Colorado
Joined: 22 Nov 2004
Reading list: 15 books

Posts: 813

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 5:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'm going to go with home decor shield, as well.

I assume that this thing has been "restored," as the wooden haft of the axe, as well as the spear and arrow shafts are not intact. If these items are of the same era (as there grouping in the same display implies), then I doubt that the wood or leather from the shield would still be there. So, if it was restored, why is it split rather noticably? The whole thing looks like it has been a bit neglected, and if you are going to put the perishable parts of the shield back together, why not do it for the axe, spear, and arrows? The whole thing just feels a bit incongruous to me, and makes me doubt (perhaps unfairly) the authenticity of the display.

I also notice that the boss doesn't really seem to fit that shield. With the decorative ironwork on there, it holds the boss up in a way that makes the whole thing seem crude. It strikes me more as the work of a modern craftsman (though I hesitate to use that word) who felt the crude construction lent the item an air of "authenticity," rather than the work of someone who, either had to make a shield that was functional for self defense, or make a shield that was presentable for some kind of ceremony.

Just my thoughts on the matter. I could easily be wrong.

-Grey

"So long as I can keep the path of honor I am well content."
-Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, The White Company
View user's profile Send private message
Gordon Frye




Location: Kingston, Washington
Joined: 20 Apr 2004
Reading list: 15 books

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 1,191

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 5:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Wow, my first reaction to seeing that shield was "Ugh! Victorian Reproduction!". Odd that it would be in with the "real" stuff though if it were. Maybe the ugly Victorian things weren't that far from reality after all! Still looks like a LOT of iron on that shield for "every day use" as it were.

Gordon

"After God, we owe our victory to our Horses"
Gonsalo Jimenez de Quesada
http://www.renaissancesoldier.com/
http://historypundit.blogspot.com/
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
Peter Johnsson
Industry Professional



Location: Storvreta, Sweden
Joined: 27 Aug 2003
Reading list: 1 book

Spotlight topics: 3
Posts: 1,757

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 11:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

This is one example of perhaps half a dozen surviving shields form the 12th or perhaps rather 13th C (if my memory is correct) They are not as big in diameter as the typical viking shiled but more like big bucklers.
They are also quite a bit more beautifull in real life than you might think from the photo. (Or perhaps it is just my taste that is excentric? -I like them a lot!)
If you are in Oslo, you must visit the Oldsaksamlingen. Here you will find these and much more fashinating things on display.

The iron work on these shields have something in common with the reiforcement on church doors from the 13t C. The wood is not very thick, nor is the iron work. I do not think they are overly heavy. Nor do I think there is any doubt on the authentisity of these shields.

I have an article on these shields somewhere, but it is packed away in preparation for moving house.
Perhaps we have some more Norweigans on the forum who live near Oslo and know the display intimately?
-Anders Helseth, are you out there somewhere? (Anders is an archaeometallurgist and works at this museum. He is a member of the group "Kongshirden" who do reenactment of the 13th C)
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Alina Boyden





Joined: 19 Apr 2004

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 383

PostPosted: Mon 06 Dec, 2004 11:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peter Johnsson wrote:
This is one example of perhaps half a dozen surviving shields form the 12th or perhaps rather 13th C (if my memory is correct) They are not as big in diameter as the typical viking shiled but more like big bucklers.
They are also quite a bit more beautifull in real life than you might think from the photo. (Or perhaps it is just my taste that is excentric? -I like them a lot!)
If you are in Oslo, you must visit the Oldsaksamlingen. Here you will find these and much more fashinating things on display.

The iron work on these shields have something in common with the reiforcement on church doors from the 13t C. The wood is not very thick, nor is the iron work. I do not think they are overly heavy. Nor do I think there is any doubt on the authentisity of these shields.

I have an article on these shields somewhere, but it is packed away in preparation for moving house.
Perhaps we have some more Norweigans on the forum who live near Oslo and know the display intimately?
-Anders Helseth, are you out there somewhere? (Anders is an archaeometallurgist and works at this museum. He is a member of the group "Kongshirden" who do reenactment of the 13th C)


I was thinking the same thing about church doors. I happen to be a fan of church doors and also think that this shield is neat looking. Then again I find a viking round by itself to be too heavy to fight with so I'd probably not touch one of these with a ten foot pole.
View user's profile
Johan S. Moen




Location: Kristiansand, Norway
Joined: 26 Jan 2004

Posts: 259

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 3:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peter Johnsson wrote:
This is one example of perhaps half a dozen surviving shields form the 12th or perhaps rather 13th C (if my memory is correct) They are not as big in diameter as the typical viking shiled but more like big bucklers.
They are also quite a bit more beautifull in real life than you might think from the photo. (Or perhaps it is just my taste that is excentric? -I like them a lot!)
If you are in Oslo, you must visit the Oldsaksamlingen. Here you will find these and much more fashinating things on display.

The iron work on these shields have something in common with the reiforcement on church doors from the 13t C. The wood is not very thick, nor is the iron work. I do not think they are overly heavy. Nor do I think there is any doubt on the authentisity of these shields.

I have an article on these shields somewhere, but it is packed away in preparation for moving house.
Perhaps we have some more Norweigans on the forum who live near Oslo and know the display intimately?
-Anders Helseth, are you out there somewhere? (Anders is an archaeometallurgist and works at this museum. He is a member of the group "Kongshirden" who do reenactment of the 13th C)


Would this perhaps be an example of what we call a "strykjernsskjold"? Saw the reference on the Kongshirden 1308 webpage, but I have not found many other references to it. It is always described as a smaller, heavyer shield, as you said some sort of big buckler.

Johan Schubert Moen
View user's profile Send private message
Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Likes: 1 page

Posts: 201

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 5:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peter Johnsson wrote:
This is one example of perhaps half a dozen surviving shields form the 12th or perhaps rather 13th C (if my memory is correct) They are not as big in diameter as the typical viking shiled but more like big bucklers.
They are also quite a bit more beautifull in real life than you might think from the photo. (Or perhaps it is just my taste that is excentric? -I like them a lot!)
If you are in Oslo, you must visit the Oldsaksamlingen. Here you will find these and much more fashinating things on display.

The iron work on these shields have something in common with the reiforcement on church doors from the 13t C. The wood is not very thick, nor is the iron work. I do not think they are overly heavy. Nor do I think there is any doubt on the authentisity of these shields.

I have an article on these shields somewhere, but it is packed away in preparation for moving house.
Perhaps we have some more Norweigans on the forum who live near Oslo and know the display intimately?
-Anders Helseth, are you out there somewhere? (Anders is an archaeometallurgist and works at this museum. He is a member of the group "Kongshirden" who do reenactment of the 13th C)


Thanks, Peter. Very interesting.
View user's profile Send private message
Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Likes: 1 page

Posts: 201

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 5:44 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Johan S. Moen wrote:
Peter Johnsson wrote:
This is one example of perhaps half a dozen surviving shields form the 12th or perhaps rather 13th C (if my memory is correct) They are not as big in diameter as the typical viking shiled but more like big bucklers.
They are also quite a bit more beautifull in real life than you might think from the photo. (Or perhaps it is just my taste that is excentric? -I like them a lot!)
If you are in Oslo, you must visit the Oldsaksamlingen. Here you will find these and much more fashinating things on display.

The iron work on these shields have something in common with the reiforcement on church doors from the 13t C. The wood is not very thick, nor is the iron work. I do not think they are overly heavy. Nor do I think there is any doubt on the authentisity of these shields.

I have an article on these shields somewhere, but it is packed away in preparation for moving house.
Perhaps we have some more Norweigans on the forum who live near Oslo and know the display intimately?
-Anders Helseth, are you out there somewhere? (Anders is an archaeometallurgist and works at this museum. He is a member of the group "Kongshirden" who do reenactment of the 13th C)


Would this perhaps be an example of what we call a "strykjernsskjold"? Saw the reference on the Kongshirden 1308 webpage, but I have not found many other references to it. It is always described as a smaller, heavyer shield, as you said some sort of big buckler.

Johan Schubert Moen


Hi, Johan. "strykejernsskjold" is probably a "heater" shield, which have the shape of a strykejern. (an iron)

View user's profile Send private message
Johan S. Moen




Location: Kristiansand, Norway
Joined: 26 Jan 2004

Posts: 259

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 6:04 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Einar Drønnesund wrote:

Hi, Johan. "strykejernsskjold" is probably a "heater" shield, which have the shape of a strykejern. (an iron)



Yes, if one looks at the name, then it would be logical to assume that it is a heather shield. But the descriptions I have read refer to something more buckler-like. But, I agree, a strykjernsskjold is probably a heather shield, now that you mention it.

Johan Schubert Moen
View user's profile Send private message
Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Likes: 1 page

Posts: 201

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 6:17 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Johan S. Moen wrote:
Einar Drønnesund wrote:

Hi, Johan. "strykejernsskjold" is probably a "heater" shield, which have the shape of a strykejern. (an iron)



Yes, if one looks at the name, then it would be logical to assume that it is a heather shield. But the descriptions I have read refer to something more buckler-like. But, I agree, a strykjernsskjold is probably a heather shield, now that you mention it.

Johan Schubert Moen


It depends what they are comparing it to. if they describe it as a smaller, heavier shield, then I think that is correct if they compare it to an erlier kite shield. If its described as a smaller, round shield on the other hand, then I would agree that it sounds like they mean a buckler.
View user's profile Send private message
Alexi Goranov
myArmoury Alumni


myArmoury Alumni

Location: San Francisco, CA
Joined: 24 Jan 2004
Reading list: 72 books

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 1,191

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 7:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If the wood work is original, it ought to be very informative in terms of construction methods. I will be nice to see the back of this shield.

Alexi
View user's profile Send private message
Greyson Brown




Location: Windsor, Colorado
Joined: 22 Nov 2004
Reading list: 15 books

Posts: 813

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 8:02 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Greyson Brown wrote:
Just my thoughts on the matter. I could easily be wrong.


And it looks like I was, too. Oh well, At least I learned something. Thanks for the clarrification, Peter.

-Grey

"So long as I can keep the path of honor I am well content."
-Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, The White Company
View user's profile Send private message
Johan S. Moen




Location: Kristiansand, Norway
Joined: 26 Jan 2004

Posts: 259

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 8:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'm going home next week, so if I have time I'll pop by the museum and try to find that thing.

Johan Schubert Moen
View user's profile Send private message
Lee O'Hagan




Location: Northamptonshire,England
Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Likes: 6 pages

Posts: 529

PostPosted: Tue 07 Dec, 2004 9:04 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thats a fine looking shield,
not a subject i really have any experience with so,
Q,
How much damage this particuler item could do to a steel object connecting with it,more so the iron sections,
or just a little side swipe when in close,
it does look to be quite sturdy, i'm thinking blunt force damage,?
as well as heavy duty protection,
Thanks for any insights, Confused
View user's profile Send private message
David R. Glier





Joined: 01 Mar 2004

Posts: 146

PostPosted: Wed 08 Dec, 2004 10:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Fascinating. I also think it's beautiful. Cool

Peter: What does "not as big" mean in this case? Daimeter around what... 20", 24", 28"??? Just judging by the size of the boss, it doesn't *seem* like it's all that small. If the wood was, say, 1/4" and the steel was *only* 16 guage, it also wouldn't be particularly heavy, either.

I'd love to make a repro sometime.
View user's profile Send private message
Scott Woodruff





Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Likes: 8 pages

Posts: 605

PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2010 6:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sorry to dig up this ancient thread, but would Peter or anyone else please post any further info you may have, such as diameter, other measurements, other examples, anything you have on Scandinavian shields of 1100-1400 AD. I would be extremely appreciative. Thank you Einar for bringing this shield to my attention, and thank you Peter for the tidbits of info.
View user's profile Send private message
Nils Anderssen




Location: Drammen, Norway
Joined: 08 Dec 2005

Posts: 61

PostPosted: Wed 29 Dec, 2010 5:39 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi,

You can find detailed pictures of the shield/buckler displayed at the Museum of Cultural History in oslo here:

http://www.vikverir.no/ressurser.html (in the medieval part of the gallery).

I don't have any exact measurements of it, but i guess it is about 45 cm in diameter.

There is also a thread about some other similar, but smaller, Norwegian bucklers here:
[url]http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=7398&highlight= [/url]
If you look at Vegard Vike (a curator at Museum of Cultural History in Oslo) post on his reconstruction you may find more information.
The first shield looks like it is thinner than these four.

There are two similar bucklers displayed in Copenhagen, but I don't have any pictures of them right now, but I will post them as soon as possible.

Underneath you can find a picture of one of my bucklers based on one of the Norwegian finds (made by Øyvind Ottnes).

The weight of these bucklers are in the heavier end of the scale, but my experience is is an advantage when you are fighting. A lighter buckler tend to be pushed all over the place, while a heavier buckler is more stabile and absorbs shock better. The downside to the weight is that it is of course heavier to fight with and requires more strength.

Hope this helps out Happy



 Attachment: 37.5 KB
Buckler_2.jpg


 Attachment: 37.39 KB
Buckler_1.jpg

View user's profile Send private message


Display posts from previous:   
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Funky Viking shield
Page 1 of 2 Reply to topic
Go to page 1, 2  Next All times are GMT - 8 Hours

View previous topic :: View next topic
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum






All contents © Copyright 2003-2024 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum