Cup hilt rapier. Finger rings? -- myArmoury.com

Felix Grashalmstahl · Posted: Sat 29 Mar, 2008 8:32 am Post subject: Cup hilt rapier. Finger rings?

Hello. I'm from Moscow, Russia. Because of the law, It's impossible to import a good replica of rapier to my country. That is why I have to order my rapier with a local replica manufacturer, who is not keen on rapiers.

Now I'm making a draft of a cup-hilted rapier for my manufacturer. Could somebody please provide me photos or drafts (if possible) of the inner part of the cup (ricasso area)? Are there finger rings or a quillon block? What are they looking like?

Thank you.

Bill Grandy · myArmoury Team

I'll search to see if I have a picture later, but many cup hilt rapiers do indeed have the finger rings. I have seen a few late period ones that do not, though I think those are exceptions.

If you took the actual cup off of the hilt, they typically look more or less like this:
http://www.arms-n-armor.com/view.html?rapier212b.jpg

And where the finger ring touches the cup it is often screwed on (with a flat head screw) to hold it in place, as you can somewhat see here on this Arms and Armor piece:
http://www.arms-n-armor.com/view.html?rapier127b.jpg

Bill Grandy · myArmoury Team

Here are two images of two antiques. Both are late 17th century, I believe. One has finger rings and one does not.

Felix Grashalmstahl · Posted: Sun 30 Mar, 2008 4:02 am Post subject:

Thank you!

Could you please tell me, what were these finger rings for? Just to fix the cup better?

Craig Johnson · Industry Professional

Hi Felix

This is Craig from Arms & Armor. I think we have exchanged emails before.

The rings are used to set the cup securely. This is usually done with screws. There is also usually a circular plate down in the cup that can be used as an anchor. Cup hilts developed from the standard rapier hilt which has the forearms as well. Some later cups used a ricasso cover to set the cup. There are some like the one Bill posted the picture of that eliminated the forearms.

Best
Craig

Felix Grashalmstahl · Posted: Wed 02 Apr, 2008 12:17 am Post subject:

Craig, Bill, thank you!

Craig, about that circular plate, working as an anchor - is this construction the same as on modern sport foils?

My manufacturer suggests to weld the cup at connection with aquillons and finger rings. He says, that welding would look much better, than screws and that the thread of a screw could become deformed very soon. Could you please comment this?