Info Favorites Register Log in
myArmoury.com Discussion Forums

Forum index Memberlist Usergroups Spotlight Topics Search


myArmoury.com is now completely member-supported. Please contribute to our efforts with a donation. Your donations will go towards updating our site, modernizing it, and keeping it viable long-term.
Last 10 Donors: Anonymous, Daniel Sullivan, Chad Arnow, Jonathan Dean, M. Oroszlany, Sam Arwas, Barry C. Hutchins, Dan Kary, Oskar Gessler, Dave Tonge (View All Donors)

Forum Index > Makers and Manufacturers Talk > Making myself an Arn scabbard, need opinions Reply to topic
This is a standard topic  

Arn Scabbard; Recreate the movie version, or do more?
Recreate the movie version
32%
 32%  [ 8 ]
Need's only a little more to it
36%
 36%  [ 9 ]
Need's a lot more to it
16%
 16%  [ 4 ]
Other (what would you do, please elaborate)
16%
 16%  [ 4 ]
Total Votes : 25

Author Message
Brian K.
Industry Professional



Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Joined: 01 Jan 2008

Posts: 727

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Sat 25 Sep, 2010 12:31 pm    Post subject: Making myself an Arn scabbard, need opinions         Reply with quote

Hello,

So I've got a spare moment, and I want to make myself a personal Arn scabbard for my Albion Arn sword. I'm tossing around the idea of just recreating the movie prop, but wondered if the scabbard should have a bit more too it. I'm split because of trying to remain true to the film, and my own personal instinct for wanting to compliment the sword itself.

Here is the link to Albion's version: http://filmswords.com/arn/arn-scabbard-suite.htm

The sword itself is a little more on the embellished side, with an engraved pommel, engraved guard, and engraved blade. The grip is a step above normal with multiple risers. The scabbard itself is on the simple side, and I'm wondering if perhaps their should be a little more tooling? I thought perhaps recreating the phrase on the guard on the central part of the scabbard running down the middle, below the suspension knot.

So I ask myself, does the scabbard itself properly compliment the blade? Is it too simple? Or just right?

What would you do?

Brian Kunz
www.dbkcustomswords.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Zach Gordon




Location: Vermont. USA
Joined: 07 Oct 2008

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 252

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Sat 25 Sep, 2010 3:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi,
I am not saying this to be offensive, but it's just my opinion. If it's for sale I would, perhaps, question the morality of a direct copy. I would feel that since Albion made the original it would be more akin to a copy than original work. You would be just copying an already for sale item. I am not sure of the copyrights or intellectual property rights held by Albion and Arn... so a direct copy may be legal, but perhaps not ethical. In a business like this where everyone is kinda friends... I would be nervous coming off as immoral. Also if I wanted to buy an Arn scabbard I'd buy it from Albion.
If it's for yourself and you aren't going to sell it then I guess its ok... although I personally would still be nervous advertising it as an example of my own work.
But hey that's just my opinion Happy
Z
View user's profile Send private message
Jean Thibodeau




PostPosted: Sat 25 Sep, 2010 6:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well Zach brings up an important point for discussion but for personal use I don't think there is a problem but you might one day decide to sell the sword and scabbard ?

Have you seen the actual movie scabbard ? Is it exactly the same as the Albion one that Albion sells or slightly different ? Movie props may different in subtle ways from the production model scabbard: if so copy the one seen on film if you can find a good pic of it. If it's close to identical to the one Albion offers then forget the above as irrelevant.

On the other hand I'm guessing you are really itching for an excuse to create your own design. Wink Razz Laughing Out Loud

Any good excuse to make your ideas come to life rather than copying the movie scabbard.

Hmmmmmmm: Just a thought but in period a scabbard could get damaged and destroyed or worn out so maybe a richer/older Arn ( I assume he doesn't die at the end of the movie .... don't know the story ) could have a more ornate scabbard made for his sword or have a second scabbard for his sword.

Anyway, your own design sort of deals with ambiguous moral questions. Wink Big Grin

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
View user's profile Send private message
Addison C. de Lisle




Location: South Carolina
Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Likes: 27 pages

Posts: 614

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Sat 25 Sep, 2010 6:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I personally like the Arn scabbard, but I would also like to see what you come up with. The current offering is a touch on the plain side (probably intentionally to be appropriate to the character, but I don't know the story) - it would be pretty neat to see a more elaborate version with that tooling you love so much. Happy Even something as simple as one or two straight lines down the length of the scabbard would really dress it up.

As for morality; if it's for your personal use I guess it's fine, but as Zach said, I would not advertise it on your site because I feel like it would be treading on some toes - plus it would probably be a copyright issue.

Anyway, designing a project is half the fun! Happy

www.addisondelisle.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Jean Thibodeau




PostPosted: Sat 25 Sep, 2010 6:16 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well if you absolutely want the Arm scabbard as seen in the movie you could buy one from Albion and make your own personal interpretation for yourself ( different design not copied from the Albion design ).

On the other hand as a talented maker of scabbards it would feel odd to buy one from someone else, normally, but if it's to have the full Albion made package then maybe this is something to consider ?

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
View user's profile Send private message
JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Sat 25 Sep, 2010 6:55 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'd recreate the one from the movies - keep it simple and elegant.

Many people do movie inspired pieces, I see no ethical problem at all if you are keeping it for yourself and not offering it as production for same. If you were going to offer it as a production design, then there might be an issue. In that case, I would just do my own version of the Arn scabbard.

Keep us posted! Happy

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
View user's profile Send private message
Brian K.
Industry Professional



Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Joined: 01 Jan 2008

Posts: 727

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Sat 25 Sep, 2010 9:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Boy o' boy, a can o' worms did I open. All good points, so thank you for the input. It is for my own personal collection, but you never know when the time comes that you need or want to sell. I've already made a couple of Arn scabbard's with my own touch for customers. They were representative of the movie version, but the chapes were different along with the tooled cross. Last but not least, the suspension had subtle differences that if you set them side by side it would be very obvious. As a whole, the scabbards are different enough to know better, but representative enough to feel like you owned something close.

The fact of the matter is, I get asked to recreate movie props all the time. Most of the time, all I have to go by is a lousy picture. I don't have any actual movie props to base my version on, so for the most part, it's based on my interpretation and not an exact copy. Most of the offers I turn down, for various reasons, but the requests are why I feel compelled to recreate the Arn scabbard for my own collection purposes. We all here collect, for various reasons, and most collectors want the item(s) to match what made them famous.

Ultimately, I have my own ideas of what I'd like to do. I started this thread because I'm not all business, as I like to think I can blend with the community as I feel more a part of that, than a business. It's still a hobby to me. I'm often having to watch what I post, for fear of repercussion, and in fact I pondered this thread before I started it but thought what the heck. I like to talk casual like the rest of you, and sometimes it's hard being a member of a forum with a business title.

I think I'll come up with something else, and call it, my own.

Brian Kunz
www.dbkcustomswords.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Marko J.





Joined: 21 Jul 2009

Posts: 36

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Sun 26 Sep, 2010 2:57 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I would base the scabbard on the original one, but improve it a bit. You are very good at tooling, so you should add some to it, perhaps with religious motives. And also a nicer chape. The original one is so basic... Such a sword deserves a scabbard with these features.
View user's profile Send private message
Thomas R.




PostPosted: Sun 26 Sep, 2010 4:27 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think this plain and functional scabbard is perfectly suited to accompany a knight templar to outremer. As far as I know the rule of the templar forbid any ornamentation or decoration on their equipement. I think, I do recall, that even so called tassel-fibulae were not allowed at their cloaks.

So make a soldiers scabbard and not a noblemans.

Thomas

http://maerenundlobebaeren.tumblr.com/
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Brian K.
Industry Professional



Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Joined: 01 Jan 2008

Posts: 727

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Sun 26 Sep, 2010 6:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is what I've got so far. My primary difference is going to be a central concave groove or 'fuller' running down 3/4 of the length starting from the suspension knot below the belt, toward the tip. This groove will be similar to the fuller on the sword.

Progress so far -


Brian Kunz
www.dbkcustomswords.com


Last edited by Brian K. on Mon 27 Sep, 2010 7:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Brian K.
Industry Professional



Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Joined: 01 Jan 2008

Posts: 727

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Mon 27 Sep, 2010 7:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

New progress


Brian Kunz
www.dbkcustomswords.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin


myArmoury Admin

Location: San Francisco
Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Likes: 29 pages
Reading list: 327 books

Spotlight topics: 32
Posts: 11,553

Feedback score: 100%
(12 total ▮ 100% positive)
PostPosted: Mon 27 Sep, 2010 7:55 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Brian, there's a lot to say but I'll only mention this:

You, sir, are very quick at your craft.

Cheers.

.:. Visit my Collection Gallery :: View my Reading List :: View my Wish List :: See Pages I Like :: Find me on Facebook .:.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Keith L. Rogers




Location: Oregon
Joined: 16 Sep 2009
Likes: 1 page

Posts: 53

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Mon 27 Sep, 2010 10:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have nothing to say on this Arn scabbard but can say, being local to Brian with three of his scabbards, that after a period of thinking about a design, he makes it happen FAST. I think he waits for his chapes, made by another person of skill, as much as anything.

Now if only his wait list were as short as his work when knife goes to leather... Razz

-klr
View user's profile Send private message
Brian K.
Industry Professional



Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Joined: 01 Jan 2008

Posts: 727

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Tue 28 Sep, 2010 6:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

When I said I have a spare moment, I wasn't kidding Big Grin

The most time consuming part of scabbard making is the design, tooling, coloring and finish. Though it may seem fast, there is still quite a bit of time logged into this one. It's just that when you've done it a lot, certain aspects get cranked out quite quickly.

Brian Kunz
www.dbkcustomswords.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Brian K.
Industry Professional



Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Joined: 01 Jan 2008

Posts: 727

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Wed 29 Sep, 2010 6:50 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Finished







Brian Kunz
www.dbkcustomswords.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin


myArmoury Admin

Location: San Francisco
Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Likes: 29 pages
Reading list: 327 books

Spotlight topics: 32
Posts: 11,553

Feedback score: 100%
(12 total ▮ 100% positive)
PostPosted: Wed 29 Sep, 2010 6:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That's stunning. I hadn't really looked at the Arn Sword before, to be honest, but seeing it all dressed up makes it shine. That's a hell of a kit. Well done.
.:. Visit my Collection Gallery :: View my Reading List :: View my Wish List :: See Pages I Like :: Find me on Facebook .:.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Jean Thibodeau




PostPosted: Wed 29 Sep, 2010 7:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nice work as usual. Cool
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
View user's profile Send private message
Ron Reimer




Location: Australia
Joined: 16 Aug 2010

Posts: 56

Feedback score: None
PostPosted: Wed 29 Sep, 2010 10:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Beautiful work , I doff my hat to you.
Since the ARN scabard seems to be a copy of a design correct to the period portrayed I don't think any could really claim exclusivity on it.
Again an absolutely beautiful piece of work!!!
View user's profile Send private message


Display posts from previous:   
Forum Index > Makers and Manufacturers Talk > Making myself an Arn scabbard, need opinions
Page 1 of 1 Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 8 Hours

View previous topic :: View next topic
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum






All contents © Copyright 2003-2024 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum